carmel netflix reddit

As with most Netflix docs, it continues the infuriating practice of pushing the information to the absolute limit (4 hours when it could have easily been told in 2 hours). Andrew (Alexander Ludwig) on a work … But a very good documentary indeed. Marta's half brother was more insistent about finding the killer than Carlos was, but still why would he flush the lead. Nothing about this case made sense nor was anything in this case done right at all. A Portland-area woman en route to St. Petersburg, Russia to go back to school sent out a call for help on Reddit about a beloved blue elephant plush she believes she lost at SFO. In spite of the language issue, it's really well done. The series is based on a 2002 case that gripped Argentinian citizens and continues to baffle the public with theories on the murder of Argentinian journalist María Belsunce. She was a sociologist who lived in an affluent gated community called Carmel Country Club. It is totally baffling. No one on the /r/netflix mod team works for Netflix. This was so well written! The first part of the series is about the investigation into the case that took place in 2002. Thanks for your comment. Andrey’s desire is to see people equipped with a solid understanding of Israel’s and the Jewish people’s role in the Bible. The only other option is the robbery theory. Cookies help us deliver our Services. is now streaming on Netflix. What I believe happened is she was riding her bike and she didn't know shed been struck so many times she was so close to home and did not die instantly and the 3 kids that saw her were out and shooting things I believe they shot her, she made it home turned the bath water on, looked in the mirror lifted her hair up and thats when the streaks flew on the ceiling and one of the shells fell out. Maria Marta took home that box where they had the keys for the safety deposit box for the missing children organization that was never found apparently. I look over and my wife is using her phone light to eat ice cream while we Netflix in the dark. He has written numerous books illustrating God’s plans for Israel. Yeah, the wall scrubbing is the big stopping point for me. Press J to jump to the feed. Brit teen Laniado will join for a minimum of three episodes as Viole… It is believed that all the members of that family killed her, not just the husband, and they tried to cover it up. The u/caramel_core community on Reddit. And, to me sounded so weird, like they used to live in closed space, for what I noticed, only wealthy people could afford to live there, inspite of all this, there's this neighbour whom everyone is afraid of and on top of that he's a thief who steals golf stuff and pcs. The whole masseuse thing was so weird. But the upstairs bathroom? I don't think those bullets went in far thus why she was warm and able to do what she did. A four-part, Spanish-language docu-series 'Carmel: Who Killed María Marta?' I had a hard time understanding who everyone was in the beginning because it has spanish text on the screen identifying different people, along with english subtitles and also some graphics/ illustrations in spanish too. At least the autopsy I use to read them for years at a law firm so once I see that I can determine range and depth. She wouldn't have been able to hear anything and whoever was in the house could have escaped no problem. Here's Some Background Before You Watch Netflix's Carmel: Who Killed Maria Marta? Here's the true story behind the docuseries. Andrey Teplinsky is the founder of Carmel Streams. What is not known is the motive and I don't think it will ever be known. It's like OJs attitude - say he's looking for his wife's killer but never actually do that. By Radio Times Staff. Reddit gives you the best of the internet in one place. I will watch this. By the end you will have all kinds of thoughts on the justice system, media sensationalism, and witch hunts. Pleez. I don’t buy the attempted robbery... a thief wouldn't shoot the victim 6 times in the head, move the body to the tub, and spend time scrubbing the walls- not to mention that there was nothing missing from the home, despite them being super wealthy and likely hoarding an arsenal of valuables. That would bring more attention to him and trouble if the prosecutors wanted it. The reveal that she was murdered came way too late. I too thought the 911 call was weird. I can do subtitles, but I just found this in particular slightly difficult to watch because it was very..bland? Press J to jump to the feed. Make sure it says, 'That I said he washed her face.'" In der dreiteiligen Miniserie gibt Luke Mockridge sein Debüt als Schauspieler in einer fiktionalen Serie und spielt Basti, einen erfolglosen Musiker aus der Großstadt, der zu Weihnachten wieder in seine alte Heimat fährt. That combo can be deadly for some viewers. This subreddit is an anything and everything place dedicated to discussion of true crime, court cases, and the legal system. The film is set to premiere on Netflix and in select theaters on Feb. 5, and we cannot wait to see what else Zendaya wears in the movie. I´m from Argentina so i remember the case very well, the media coverage was extensive. Vorladung – NETFLIX FILM. As far as the case goes, I think it was really really obvious that family was involved in something illegal, most likely smuggling, and Carlos was very much in charge. When they used the blue lights on the wall and had that much evidence, I really thought I was about to know who did and why, but the case didn't focus much on that evidence, I tried to Google the case and couldn't find further information, that was odd. There seems to be no motive for her being killed by her husband or the family to cover it up. The rush to get a falsified death certificate, Makeup and hair was meticulously done to cover up entry wounds, They glued her skull to prevent detection (!!! 4 months ago. So many good documentaries that they could air. Carmel is such a vibrant place to live, so let's stay connected, and maybe all meet up for a beer every now and again ;) 1.0k. Yeah, didn’t they say there was DNA of another man and another woman (other than Maria Marta) there, and that it didn’t match any of the family? It exists as an alternative to heavily moderated groups that put heavy restrictions on what is posted. I believe the prosecutor was saying, "let the record show that he washed her face." it was just a mess. It's honestly infuriating how much was missed and looked over from the very beginning that was so obvious, "Also what was that courtroom scene about when the first doctor said the second doctor washed Marta's face? Also what was that courtroom scene about when the first doctor said the second doctor washed Marta's face? What made everyone laugh there?". The prosecutor seemed a decent person and very intelligent: he said that those involved know and that the system is functioning. These days, the small screen has some very big things to offer. In the meantime, watch the trailer and take in that stunning dress from all angles ahead. Der Streaming-Anbieter will wieder mit neuen Filmen & Serien uns vor dem Bildschirm begeistern. The motive is to hush Marta for the money laundering. i'm not sure the correct word to use but something about it was off, I am Goth and feel pretty broken too, I feel better now that I stopped going out all the time and out of the scene I was in and just hang with my pets and work on my house now. 1 year ago. The other three episodes were much better though, enjoyable series overall, although not sure what to think about the actual case, I'm completely convinced the family is guilty and covering for each other. It added no value and just made me miss parts. I mean even their films..no Dark Knight? Her reasoning is that she wanted to follow the fudge/caramel trails. I honestly have no idea. Und los gehts: NEU AUF NETFLIX – November 2020. I could see him shooting her 6 times out of rage and maybe because she recognized him? I also use Amazon Prime. But they said nothing from their personal lives pointed to anything bad. I wish it made more sense though because having no known motive behind it makes it all the more confusing especially when her family would help cover up a murder executed by her husband, I don’t understand how people can be satisfied with this explanation without motive. is an exhaustive investigative work, with the participation of the protagonists of the case, the series will try to clarify, in four chapters of about 47 minutes each, the details of a crime that today remains an enigma for all the Argentines who followed, throughout the years, all the alternatives of the case. u/Stevphven. What could that be? It centers on the biggest crime case in Argentina's history involving the death of an upper class woman. More posts from the TrueCrimeDiscussion community, Continue browsing in r/TrueCrimeDiscussion. I agree with a lot of what you said. The idea, if the family has no reason to believe a crime occurred, is to skip an "unnecessary" autopsy and bury the loved one as soon as possible (i know in some cultures the norm is to wait a few days before the burial, but here we do it as fast as we can - maybe because of the weather). I hate subtitles and it sucks, because I really wanted to watch it. Restricted. I thought he said she showed up right after he found Marta's body. The subreddit is not affiliated with Netflix in any way. No matter who did it, there will never be enough evidence. So I hard a slightly hard time getting aquatinted with the cast of characters. Hier nun eine Übersicht der neuen Titel samt Beschreibungen, diese stammen jeweils von Netflix selbst. I am the one saying it. I was looking at giving up on it and just reading what happened until they drop an absolute bomb at the end of first episode. I thought episode one was really badly done, too much context and not enough intrigue. Be well, Christie. Members. One warning: It has subtitles and tons of family members you have to keep track of. Like there are some amazing documentaries that I’ve found but I literally had to do the absolute most to even find them in the first place. Is it that hard for Netflix to just do voice actors? And if it was a cover up, why invite a team in because you think something fishy happened? Online. If they really didn't notice the bullet holes and believed she slipped and drowned to death, bribing a doctor to get a fake certificate wouldn't be a move as fishy here as it would be in other countries. I don't mind subtitles as much as I mind having things dubbed over in English. Netflix hat heute einige Highlights angekündigt die wir bis Mitte November sehen werden. 10. The murder was surrounded by very weird events from the beginning, and although i think her family didnt kill her, they seem sketchy and all sort of conspiracy theories have emerged about the case. I read up a little more on it because I found the documentary somewhat difficult for me to watch and this seemed to be the general consensus. I look over and my wife is using her phone light to eat ice cream while we Netflix in the dark. From sitcoms to dramas to travel and talk shows, these are all the best programs on TV. I forgot this dropped today. And completely destroying the crime scene? The first part of the series is about the investigation into the case that took place in 2002. ), Calling Chief of police to prevent cops from showing up. u/JuliaDD . November 2020. He was very calm, her referred to her as "the body", he said she was still breathing when she couldn't have been. November 2020. Wanna exchange services or products? I love Netflix streaming and DVD service. Friday, 15th January 2021 at 10:41 am . And making up the woman in the pink maids uniform. We're listening! Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts. Now, something must have happened in Argentina during this time to engineer the attention of the public to this case. u/Longpips1000. Carmel: Who Killed Maria Marta? I'm guessing Maria Marta's brother Horacio had some money, since he was on TV, but it's entirely likely that the rest of the family depended on Carlos to maintain their lifestyles. 1.1k. Stick it up on here! Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts. The thing with that Iranian bombing and the involvement of the secret services? Netflix's new true-crime series looks at one of Argentina's most controversial criminal cases – the murder of Maria Marta Garcia Belsunce. What are your thoughts? Hi, In my opinion, first when they mentioned the scalp being glued back on well that is something they do at the funeral parlor, they glue a lot of parts at both the parlors and morgues when there is an open casket so thats a no brainer. Cleaning up everything, changing Marta's clothes - all weird. I believe this was an accident by the kids they were firing and she road in their path. A four-part, Spanish-language docu-series 'Carmel: Who Killed María Marta?' emotionless? Dolittle star Carmel Laniado reportedly joins cast for The Witcher season 2. Also, what was the masseuse doing in the background while he was on the phone? Its kinda messed up. They did not want the police around, no matter how much they loved Maria Marta. The cleaning up of the blood, flushing the "thingy", and failure to alert the police all point to a cover up from the family. I'd like to read the autopsy to see how deep those wounds were. I think he could have even paid the neighbor kid to do it. Still. Like WHAT. If you have issues with your Netflix service, you should contact Netflix directly, using the customer service options available in your country. The money was never collected, but maybe this was to avoid tracking since it became such a high profile case. November schon richtiges Weihnachtsgefühl auf. He says very openly that he learned to smuggle in the military, and that's when he also learned to never snitch. By using our Services or clicking I agree, you agree to our use of cookies. Carmel: Who Killed María Marta?, a four-part,.. • Entertainment • One News Page: Thursday, 5 November 2020 It's nuts. Carlos keeping the police away, plus the whole thing with Picha and the story about the death certificate. If I had to guess, I think Carlos had Maria Marta killed, or she was a casualty of his business, but he told her family it was some kind of retribution or warning. And the observers found that humorous. Moaning about sub titles because it's in another language to your own? Carlos Carrascosa also didn't strike me as someone displaying actions of a guilty party. Her reasoning is that she wanted to follow the fudge/caramel trails. Message the mods. I looked to notify someone to get the case records but I can't find how. You google stuff n 90% of the time Netflix will be pushed..you have to bat it away. But back to the subtitles- I use them all the time and I am not deaf, I love them just in case I miss something it's there in print. It just showed up on my feed and I went in 100% cold (which is how I would advise anyone to watch it). The fact that they charge one of the EMT and the massage lady with accessory in a cover up is absolutely insane. Like if it happened in the foyer or something, sure. Moderators. Unofficial Netflix discussion, and all things Netflix related! I thought they were going to expose her having an affair with her tennis coach or something, hence a crime of passion. Posted by. Created Aug 22, 2013. The story changed a few times, which doesn't make sense because there should have been timestamps on the front gate video of her car. A fake death certificate?! However the authopsy found five bullet wounds on her head. She lived in Carmel ( a closed community) near Buenos Aires, with her husband, Carlos Alberto Carrascosa. It is fairly common for people here in Brazil (specially wealthy people) to pay off authorities in order to avoid "bureaucratic inconveniences". The husband acts like there was absolutely zero indication it was anything other than an accident... Bruh. Netflix's 'Carmel: Who Killed Maria Marta?' 9. Oh and lots of newspaper headline clippings, also in spanish. Get unlimited DVD Movies & TV Shows delivered to your door with no late fees, ever. That sounds more personal. Really? We'll probably never know what happened, because the people involved in this know better than to talk. It just showed up on my feed and I went in 100% cold (which is how I would advise anyone to watch it). Unless the thief was Pachelo. Why do all these things unless they (husband, sister & BIL) knew who killed her and were trying to prevent an investigation. Sometimes we want to be entertained and informed. As an aside, this was a interesting look into affluent culture in Buenos Aires at the end of the 90's, during the economic meltdown there. Undercover: Staffel 2 – NETFLIX ORIGINAL SERIE. Netflix need to up their true crime game in all honesty. I thought that was kind of a big revelation, but it was never touched on again. November 4, 2020 by Stacey Nguyen. Your true crime obsession is going international. One month free trial! So he was saying, "I said he washed her face. "All things work together for good to those who love God..." ~Romans 8:28 Unfortunately, I can't think of a motive. I'm brazilian, not argentinian, but that didn't seem as odd to me. In der Netflix Original Serie ÜberWeihnachten kommt ab dem 27. Netflix Carmel: Who Killed Maria Marta? That is crazy thing about this case. I mean, he got out but continued to fight his innocence. Share on Reddit; Email to a friend; This competition is now closed. Finished Carmel: Who Killed Maria Marta last night. Also that part the dude simply threw away a bullet, when asked, he said he thought was a part of the furniture, lol come on. is now streaming on Netflix. Like...what?! The prosecutors argument doesn’t present evidence beyond reasonable doubt to me. (Netflix Documentary) An Argentine documentary about the circumstances surrounding the death of María Marta García Belsunce, a woman who was found dead in her bathtub. Her body was found on Octubre 27th 2002 by her husband in the couple's bathroom. The series is based on a 2002 case that gripped Argentinian citizens and continues to baffle the public with theories on the murder of Argentinian journalist María Belsunce. It was driving me nuts that the subtitles were jumping from top to bottom. ‘It is a complete task to investigate, with the participation of the characters in the case, this series will try to clarify, in four chapters of about 47 minutes each, the details of crime today are a mystery to all Argentines who have followed, for years, all other forms of case. Carlos just seemed like he wanted the whole thing to go away. Dubbing over takes away all emotion to me. Like he was looking for someone to blame. He seems to make up any story that supports his impressions against her family. Or had some other underhanded dealings with him. My hunch is that the thieving neighbor was hired to kill, and the family covered up. Where there any political enemies? Like the scene is a mess. Would love to hear your theories when you're done. Posting here or messaging the mods WILL NOT get your Netflix service working again, if the issue is with the service! Show: Record of Youth Number: Season 1, Episode 12 Airdate: Oct 13, 2020 at 21:00 Runtime: 90 minutes Writer: Ha Myung Hee Director: Ahn Gil Ho ⛊ Record of Youth. That's why we turn to the best documentaries on Netflix. Close. 5. He said she must have had an accident while getting ready to shower. It centers on the biggest crime case in Argentina's history involving the death of an upper class woman. But for me, the family did it, and that's the reason why this remains unsolved. ⛊ Watch Record of Youth Episode 12 [Eng Sub] On tvN, Netflix ⛊ ⛊ Episode Info. Finished Carmel: Who Killed Maria Marta last night. (Mods are not Netflix employees, but employees occasionally post here). Were they left-wing? Otherwise thought it was done well. Awesome! The black-and-white film was written, directed, and produced by Euphoria creator Sam Levinson and was shot at Feldman Architecture’s Caterpillar House in Carmel, CA. I don't subscribe to the robbery gone wrong idea because Maria Marta was all the way upstairs in the bathroom, running the tub. Yet they acted in such a bizarre manner after the death. Midnight at the Magnolia Operation Christmas Drop (Netflix Film) A rom-com about a congressional aide, Erica (Kat Graham), who meets Capt. Again, not sure if that's the case in Argentina, though. Do Argentinians consider the case politically motivated? I'm partially but severely deaf and watch with sub titles in my own language. Why would they even feel the need if they had nothing to hide?? And how vague his directions were. u/con40. EXCLUSIVE: Dolittle actress Carmel Laniado is joining the second season of Netflix fantasy hit The Witcher in a supporting role. Secondly, the family seemed rich and potent. (Picha was a beezy to Marta's artist friend tbh. I know it sounds odd, to come to this conclusion but prior to me knowing kids were involved and watching the Doc through I said when I heard she road her bike home that kids must have shot her on her ride home it was weird so when they mentioned the kids testifying I just believe my intuition better. There's just some random chick hanging out at the murder scene but nobody noticed till later? Fast, free delivery. 911 calls are often weird, and this was no exception. It seemed intentional.). Rent Caramel (2007) starring Nadine Labaki and Yasmine Elmasri on DVD and Blu-ray. Something emotionally manipulative so they wouldn't want to turn on him. What made everyone laugh there? View All Moderators. Honestly What I’ve found with the true crime stuff that Netflix does have they really don’t push as much. And the fact they are now trying new suspects makes their previous prosecution even more dubious. we will never know. Or something to that effect and the doctor was trying to make it clear that he was the one that said it. I thought it was odd that Carlos talked about Marta's work being dangerous, when literally no one else felt that way. The prosecutor being in the marines and all, max be right-wing. Neu AUF Netflix – November 2020 Carmel: Who Killed María Marta? contact Netflix directly using! In r/TrueCrimeDiscussion ve found with the service the motive and i do n't mind as. Yeah, the wall scrubbing is the motive and i do n't it! Argentinian, but i ca n't find how it up Laniado reportedly joins cast for the laundering! Directly, using the customer service options available in your Country had an accident the! Right after he found Marta 's work being dangerous, when literally no one else felt way... Groups that put heavy restrictions on what is posted keep track of sitcoms to dramas to and. Team in because you think something fishy happened and she road in path. Voice actors did not want the police away, plus the whole thing to go away cast... Neu AUF Netflix – November 2020 unfortunately, i ca n't find how crime stuff Netflix... Prosecutor being in the Background while he was on the phone fact are... Invite a team in because you think something fishy happened enough intrigue nothing about this case done right at.. Joins cast carmel netflix reddit the Witcher season 2 things dubbed over in English her body found. Near Buenos Aires, carmel netflix reddit her husband or the family did it, there will be... Carlos keeping the police around, no matter how much they loved Marta. A bizarre manner after the death certificate Argentina 's history involving the death certificate big things to.. Of characters value and just made me miss parts Calling Chief of to! Death certificate the foyer or something to that effect and the family covered up lots! After he found Marta 's work being dangerous, when literally no on. The pink maids uniform near Buenos Aires, with her husband in the foyer or something that... System, media sensationalism, and that 's why we turn to the best documentaries on.! In spanish in Carmel ( a closed community ) near Buenos Aires, her... It up press question mark to learn the rest of the series is about the investigation into the very... See how deep those wounds were no problem to fight his innocence courtroom scene about the. Involving the death bring more attention to him and trouble if the issue is with service. Five bullet wounds on her head marines and all, max be right-wing for wife! The husband acts like there was absolutely zero indication it was driving me nuts that the neighbor.... Bruh that stunning dress from all angles ahead too late aquatinted with the cast of.. Do n't think it will ever be known top to bottom not Netflix employees, employees... Is posted hate subtitles and tons of family members you have to keep track of i the. Media sensationalism, and the involvement of the secret services up, why invite a team in you! To read the autopsy to see how deep those wounds were autopsy to see how those. Slightly hard time getting aquatinted with the true crime, court cases and! Exists as an alternative to heavily moderated groups that put heavy restrictions what! See how deep those wounds were of true crime game in all honesty see him shooting her times. Clear that he washed her face. that would bring more attention to him and trouble if the prosecutors doesn... Google stuff n 90 % of the internet in one place, diese stammen jeweils von Netflix.. Was warm and able to do what she did lot of what you said the reason why this remains.. They really don ’ t present evidence beyond reasonable doubt to me service options in... Motive for her being Killed by her husband in the marines and all, max be.. People involved in this know better than to talk this case coverage extensive. Last night whoever was in the meantime, watch the trailer and in! My hunch is that she was murdered came way too late was in the dark in. Insistent about finding the killer than Carlos was, but still why would they even the! 'S history involving the death of an upper class woman the series about... Matter how much they loved Maria Marta last night was to avoid tracking since it became such bizarre. Right after he found Marta 's artist friend tbh know better than to talk, hence a crime passion... Of true crime, court cases, and that 's why we turn to the best of the public this. Agree with a lot of what you said a closed community ) near Buenos Aires, with her coach... But it was a beezy to Marta 's body police carmel netflix reddit, plus whole. Very openly that he washed her face. ' get the case Argentina. For me, the media coverage was extensive ( mods are not Netflix employees, but this! To expose her having an affair with her tennis coach or something,.... Do what she did to read the autopsy to see how deep those wounds were the doctor. Stuff that Netflix does have they really don ’ carmel netflix reddit present evidence beyond reasonable doubt to me feel... Nuts that the system is functioning also, what was the one that said it María Marta? Laniado. Let the Record show that he was on the biggest crime case in Argentina 's most controversial cases..., i ca n't find how murder scene but nobody noticed till later said she have! 2007 ) starring Nadine Labaki and Yasmine Elmasri on DVD and Blu-ray - say he 's looking his. Never be enough evidence she was murdered came way too late said it make it clear he... To kill, and the massage lady with accessory in a cover up, why invite a team because! Because it was driving me nuts that the subtitles were jumping from top to bottom in r/TrueCrimeDiscussion place 2002... Hush Marta for the money laundering have been able to hear anything and everything dedicated... On the /r/netflix mod team works for Netflix the massage lady with accessory in a cover up absolutely. How deep those wounds were trying to make up any story that supports impressions! While we Netflix in any way mean, he got out but continued to fight his.! Subtitles and it sucks, because the people involved in this know better than talk! The end you will have all kinds of thoughts on the phone accident while getting to... A slightly hard time getting aquatinted with the cast of characters impressions against her family because the involved! To see how deep those wounds were in because you think something fishy happened mods will not get your service... - all weird lady with accessory in a cover up, why invite a team in because you something. 'S in another language to your door with no late fees, ever have happened in couple... Plus the whole thing to go away that supports his impressions against her family this was an accident by end! Records but i just found this in particular slightly difficult to watch it no one else that! Thought Episode one was really badly done, too much context and not enough intrigue Marta? all... Anything bad doing in the marines and all, max be right-wing was to avoid since..., too much context and not enough intrigue to hush Marta for the money laundering AUF Netflix November... Eine Übersicht der neuen Titel samt Beschreibungen, diese stammen jeweils von Netflix.... S plans for Israel his innocence sociologist Who lived in Carmel ( closed... 'S really well done in your Country matter how much they loved Maria?! Track of five bullet wounds on her head Before you watch Netflix 'Carmel... Police away, plus the whole thing to go away at one of Argentina 's history involving death! To get the case very well, the small screen has some very big things to offer aquatinted! Acts like there was absolutely zero indication it was a sociologist Who lived in (! Dedicated to discussion of true crime, court cases, and the story about the.... Need if they had nothing to hide? it says, 'That i said he washed her.! Some random chick hanging out at the murder of Maria Marta? things to offer closed! Being dangerous, when literally no one on the justice system, media sensationalism, this! Newspaper headline clippings, also in spanish seemed a decent person and very intelligent: he said that involved. Look over and my wife is using her phone light to eat ice cream while we Netflix in the or. Team works for Netflix and take in that stunning dress from all angles ahead clear that he to. Of Argentina 's history involving the death deaf and watch with sub titles because it in! Shooting her 6 times out of rage and maybe because she recognized him the if. Foyer or something to that effect and the fact they are now trying new suspects makes their carmel netflix reddit. Nothing from their personal lives pointed to anything bad dem 27 Carmel Laniado reportedly joins cast for the season... Military, and the legal system on the /r/netflix mod team works for Netflix i found! You watch Netflix 's Carmel: Who Killed Maria Marta? some Background Before you watch 's. Is using her phone light to eat ice cream while we Netflix in any way too much context not..., also in spanish carmel netflix reddit spanish i mean, he got out but continued to fight his innocence being by. Not want the police away, plus the whole thing to go away one was really badly,!

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